Who really gains with all the "ECO" hype

[Punched]

I am very new to forums a virgin you might say, but I was very interested in Eco Friendly side to A1BF, as this is close to my heart.
Then I read some of the comments posted by moderators saying, who cares about the environment, why can’t I leave have all the pleasures in live, we don’t emit CO2 it the power companies do. They’re the ones responsible.
Stating the obvious... They generate the power because we use it!
So I now I have 2 questions to ask.
Is this the right place for me?
Can anyone give me a good reason why I should stay?
P.S. I am no Hippy..

Why would you go???

Like everything there are two sides to every story, for years the UK Public have been ripped off left right and center, and after all the Lies from the Government, The academics, and from the international Institute for Climate change, who can we trust??

In the UK we are Taxed like nobodies business making it sound like we alone can save the planet its all a con and a ruse to get more tax from us. and to be honest people are just getting sick and tired of all of it, and i'm not the only one.

If we are going to save the planet, why do we need to pay, in some cases 50% more for "Eco" products, that says it all really.

Whilst theres been some great debates here on this very forum, there are as always valid points raised from both sides of the coin, you just need to speak out and not just say "Shall i go??" that don't really add to the debate.

I look at Facts and i see the Government has Lied, The Universitys and Proffessors have Lied, and the guy thats running the International Climate change institute has lied, so who do we trust, not one person has come up with any real proof, so who do we believe.

All good Forums have a Classic Debate, and this thing with "ECO" and "Climate Change" is pretty Popular amonst members, you need to be part of the arguement, and looking at your 2 posts it seems that you've not added your thoughts lately, Join in and be part of the Debate, its what makes A1 the best

[Green East]

I agree that people in high places have lied, and would have us believing the End is Nigh.
But can we really go on using up all the Earth’s resources without a care? We have been using petrochemicals in so many things, from beauty products to games consoles. As well running all the combustion engines around the world, we have to run out sometime.
It takes millions of years for coal to form and only minutes to burn. One day there will be no more fossil fuels, what then?
Think of the billions upon billions of plastic bags that have been buried under or feet. They are still there, lasting up to 500 years. One of our biggest sellers is compostable plastic bags which at least rot down within 90 days in the correct conditions. Why haven’t we been using these for the last 100 years?...
Because it’s cheaper to make them out of petrochemicals.
Cheap is not always the best answer.

Denis

[HuggyBear]

And because I am a moderator; doesn't mean I can't have an opinion.

I'm a realist, I don't BS - by me leaving my light on over night my house does not emit one ounce of Carbon - if anything, the elderly chap who lives over the road from me, who has a log fire, emits more carbon dioxide through that!

TBH - apart from breaking wind, I can't think of one thing in my house that emits gases that damage the environment

[Punched]

I agree that people in high places have lied, and would have us believing the End is Nigh.
But can we really go on using up all the Earth’s resources without a care? We have been using petrochemicals in so many things, from beauty products to games consoles. As well running all the combustion engines around the world, we have to run out sometime.
It takes millions of years for coal to form and only minutes to burn. One day there will be no more fossil fuels, what then?
Think of the billions upon billions of plastic bags that have been buried under or feet. They are still there, lasting up to 500 years. One of our biggest sellers is compostable plastic bags which at least rot down within 90 days in the correct conditions. Why haven’t we been using these for the last 100 years?...
Because it’s cheaper to make them out of petrochemicals.
Cheap is not always the best answer.

Denis

How we live denis is all down to the Modern age, The day we invented plastic, was a stept forward to new things that we have never had before, yes it does use resources but if you add up the pros and cons then plaastic is here to stay i'm afraid.

All you need to do is look at how many lives plastic has saved since its creation, look at the hospitals with all their machinary and gadgets would they still be there without plastic, The modern age of computers, Curcuit boards all plastic. The earth would be a sad place today id we just deleted plastic.

There will always be new inventions that use up a bit more resources but the earth can replentish itself, just like a cow and its milk, otherwise we whould not of survived all these millions of years.

As for "Eco Proctucts" they cost more because of the added "Fear Factor" and additional profit made for the manufacturer, All you need to do to get some real eco friendly items is to search the internet, Vinegar, Bicarb of soda are some of the cheapest "Real" Natural Cleaners you can buy these days do a search and see what i mean, if people want to be "Really Eco Friendly" then then need to start using methoths our grandparents did, and not promoting some modern day company that claims their products are "Eco" but you need to pay a further 50% more, to me thats a rip off and don't benefit anyone except the makers of the products.

If i made a product like milk which i then claimed would cure cancer then charged 100% more, i would be mega rich, except there are safe guards in place to stop manufacturers making such claims, with Climate change, even the people that have said the poles are melting have been found out to be lying, so since there is no real proof only a lot of speculation then people will carry on ripping us off with all this eco hype.

Cheap has always been the answer My friend,

[Green East]

I'm a realist, I don't BS - by me leaving my light on over night my house does not emit one ounce of Carbon - if anything, the elderly chap who lives over the road from me, who has a log fire, emits more carbon dioxide through that!

TBH - apart from breaking wind, I can't think of one thing in my house that emits gases that damage the environment

If you use electricity or gas, then you are producing CO2 from the companies that supply you.
Almost everything in your home has its own carbon footprint. It had to be manufactured, assembled and transported, and that’s just to get it to the shop. If like this laptop I’m using, then you are emitting CO2 every time it’s charged.
If however you live in a mud hut in Africa and have no modern tech, then maybe you don’t emit CO2, only harmful gasses from your backside maybe.

All you need to do is look at how many lives plastic has saved since its creation, look at the hospitals with all their machinary and gadgets would they still be there without plastic, The modern age of computers, Curcuit boards all plastic. The earth would be a sad place today id we just deleted plastic.

OK. I agree that plastic has it benefits, without it we would not be where we are now. But we live in a throw away world, to hell with the consequences. Who cares if we are knee deep in rubbish that doesn’t degrade?
Canvas bags were around long before plastic ones. So why did we change? We want everything to be easy.
Millions of years ago there was not 7 Billion people on the earth using up its resorces.
At least I like to think I am helping.

[Paul Norman]

I think the simple answer to the opening question is, the government. Because it is a useful cover to tax us more.

That answer does not mean I think we should use up resources with no thought. I don't. It does not mean I don't think we can reduce pollution, and should. I do.

But the government are doing what we all do here. Picking on single issues and meddling. There is a huge focus on carbon emissions. This is not universally agreed by ecoists to be the biggest issue. And certainly not the only one. They are pushing for electric cars. Which use electricity, seldom generated in an environmentally friendly way, and, in any case, about to go scarce, if we believe the figures. And so on.

I actually do car about the environment. But I don't see how making me a criminal for throwing away a cardboard box, driving a nice car and thinking the G-Whiz is a bit silly is going to help the enviroment one little bit.

Changing behaviours has to start further back than that. And be more proactive. And that includes you and I, and the government. And should not be a hiding place for raising tax.

What was the carbon footprint of Copenhagen? Sorry..single issues again!

[Punched]

Hi Denis

We have been emmitting CO2 since the day Man started to roam the earth, we have been Breathing in Oxygen too, So why don't people try and save as much oxygen as we can, The fact is we breath in oxygen and emit CO2, thats what makes us Human, Trees and plants do the opposite, so it balances out if it don't then the world adapts and evolves, so by stating that we are destroying the planet is a bidt of a long shot.

We do live in a throwaway world, but thats where incinerators came in handy, Not only could we burn our rubbish, and use the heat for engery production etc, but modern incinerators are VERY Clean and have specially designed systems to remove all harmful parts of the smoke. Why don't we build more, and this would vastly help all this landfill issues, I'd sooner burn than bury anytime.

We live in a world of conveienance, where we take everything for granted, but things can be put right without making such rediculous and OTT claims about the survival of the Planet.

Do you think that the people who make Billions from selling massive windturbines give a hoot about climate change?? I think not. Whats the point in being a multi millionaire and not having Rolls Royces, Bentleys and range rovers, or even a helicopter and Private Jet. Peopel need to open their eyes and see, that we alone cannot change the fabric of the earth, Nature is looking after us by evolving during thousands of years, what we do in our lifttime does nothing and i mean nothing, so why fret and why carry on paying silly taxes to make us think only us can change the planet and save the world.

The people that pay for all this hype are the middle and working classes, To be honest if i was a multi millionaire i wouldn't give two hoots about jumping into my private jet and popping off to see Sandra and Phil

Copenhagen was never about saving the Planet, but about Power and Money, Just how many Billions did that prat Brown promise the EU, Wheres he going to raise that kind of money, from us idiots, who will continue to pay through the nose for a few good years to come.

Carbon Footprint is another word for Tax, and a way to make money, not a way to save the planet

[Green East]

Hi Gerry
I know where you are coming from with the people selling wind turbines, and yes it is mostly greed. So what happened to the saying, “For the better of mankind”? If they were reduce the costs to make them more affordable, then more people would jump to the chance of buying them.

I believe in selling a lot and making a little, rather than selling a little to make a lot. Maybe I’m not the right kind of person to be running a company?

We need to stop living with the past and find a new path for the future. If not nature will cull us the same as we cull other creatures that get over populated.

As for Mr Brown he would promise anything if he was to get elected, and so would the other parties.
Denis

[Punched]

The saying "For the better of Mankind" finishes with our Death, Should our children decide to carry it on, remains to be seen, But that saying should only relate during our lifetime and climate change does not change in our lifetime, only the same pattern that has been going on for hundreds of years since they started keeping records about temperature etc...

I believe in selling a lot and making a little, rather than selling a little to make a lot

to me that means the same, If you sell alot and make a little your increasing the manufacturing side of the products carbon footprint, for very little reward or profit for yourself, Its more eco friendly to sell less and make alot either way whichever format you go for, you could infact make the same amount of profit.

By building Eviromentaly friendly incinerators we could stop burying our rubbish in Landfill sites, then we would have stupid Wheelie Bin Rules and fines, Thanks to climate change we can now become Criminals with a Police record for leaving our Wheelie bin lids open, what a con, Soon it will be easier to live in Iran or some other Islamic country as opposed to the UK.

Never in my lifetime did i think i would ever see such a complete waste of police resources than for charging honest and decent people with a criminal record for leaving their bin lid slightly open.

As for Mr Brown he was never elected and i really doubt that he'll ever be elected in his lifetime, he'll always be know as the PM that bankrupted the UK

Bring back the incinerators

[HuggyBear]

If you use electricity or gas, then you are producing CO2 from the companies that supply you.
Almost everything in your home has its own carbon footprint. It had to be manufactured, assembled and transported, and that’s just to get it to the shop. If like this laptop I’m using, then you are emitting CO2 every time it’s charged.
If however you live in a mud hut in Africa and have no modern tech, then maybe you don’t emit CO2, only harmful gasses from your backside maybe.

Shot yourself in the foot there matey... exactly my point... by me leaving a light on I ain't emitting an ounce of carbon its the electricity who generate the carbon - so why should I turn the light off? Why shouldn't the electricity company look at more economical methods of producing electricity