uh oh, UKPLC to go bankrupt

Nicksyb · #21 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 07:48

I don't even touch politics, but after just reading all of that (and deciding it had way too much testerone) I am adding my bit

This past year personally I have been working more hours and coming home with less. The 10p tax thing was a fiasco!! I ended up losing £50 a month extra whilst a colleague who was on a higher wage got £50 extra in his wages due to tax. (Trust me he ran when he said thank you to me for the extra money)

Then the government backtrack and say they will give it back through a variety of benefits. I don't claim benefits and can't because my partner is on a highish wage so they have pocketed my money

I understand what some of you are saying about it not being all the governments fault, but I don't have luxuries all my money goes to household bills and petrol. I am lucky if I have £10 a week to spend on food and essentials. The petrol crisis has added onto our bill an extra £200 a month

there is no decent public transport to get us to work (It would take Martin 3 hours to get to owrk with countless bus changes).

What I am trying to say is that this government has screwed us and can't fix it. And it would take someone with enough guts to take over control and bring us back to life.

Thank you and goodnight

Paul Norman · #22 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 08:30

There are some lessons for individuals and for government here, and I guess it starts at the old fashioned mantra - live within your means. The government has borrowed recklessly, so have many individuals. The government has spent money on things it could have managed without. so have individuals.

The main difference is, those individuals will have to sort out their problems. Where as the debt the government is in, you and I will have to pay, penny by painful penny, for generations.

On large scale and on small they are spending money on stuff we could do without. Stuff we HAVE to do without, because we cant afford it.

I now pay massively over half of all I earn back to the government in taxes, direct and indirect. That is too much! And to add to all this, I dont hear a single politician of any political colour saying anything that makes me believe that they understand economics enough to fix this.

SBP · #23 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 09:19

Quote:

Originally Posted by Paul Norman

I now pay massively over half of all I earn back to the government in taxes, direct and indirect. That is too much! And to add to all this, I dont hear a single politician of any political colour saying anything that makes me believe that they understand economics enough to fix this.

It might be a lot higher than you think. If you are a 40% tax payer you also pay 12% national insurance and then 17.5% VAT on most things you buy plus council tax and those are just the obvious ones. Of course tax on petrol is 60-70% and the duty on diesel is higher)

So the tax as a % of your earnings you pay over to the government might be close to 60% or more (eg: if you buy a house)

RedEvo · #24 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 09:40

As ever with emotive issues in a forum, discussions become a little fraught. My simple point is, the government are in a mess but the state of the country is not entirely the fault of the government and we, as a society, should take a long hard look at ourselves.

Far from having my eyes and ears closed, as some have suggested, I believe I have them tuned in. As an adult with no children and my own business I get virtually nothing from this government and have no reason to defend them.

If you genuinely believe the mess the country is in is entirely the fault of Mr Brown and his friends then that's fine. I think they have much to answer for but I also believe there's more to it............my friends....

d

SBP · #25 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 10:10

You are absolutely right of course but it's unlikely that the people who have huge credit card debts etc that are having them written off via an IVR are thinking like that or ever will think like that.

RedEvo · #26 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 10:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBP

You are absolutely right of course but it's unlikely that the people who have huge credit card debts etc that are having them written off via an IVR are thinking like that or ever will think like that.

Couldn't agree more. It's a real problem. We have a society where success is measured in BMW's and the number of bedrooms you have. 'Have nots' play at being 'haves' with plastic cards and then it comes home to roost.

It's a complex situation IMHO.

d

Alvin · #27 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 10:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedEvo

It's a complex situation IMHO.

d

Not at all .The rich have always got there wealth off the poor,cause the othere riches ain't going to let go of there's.

The financial institutions don't lend recklessly for fun.Don't ya know.

Once Maggie introduced the idea that our prime goal was to make money anyway we could.The downhill slide was inevitable.

Bling is easier to sell than usefull products.

Alvin

Paul Norman · #28 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 10:47

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBP

It might be a lot higher than you think. If you are a 40% tax payer you also pay 12% national insurance and then 17.5% VAT on most things you buy plus council tax and those are just the obvious ones. Of course tax on petrol is 60-70% and the duty on diesel is higher)

So the tax as a % of your earnings you pay over to the government might be close to 60% or more (eg: if you buy a house)

You are right...it is massively more than half!!....and I will NEVER buy a house again in the UK all the while stamp duty is so high. To hand over £40k to Gordon Brown just as a tax on moving is one cheque too many for me I am afraid!!!

SBP · #29 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 10:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Alvin

Once Maggie introduced the idea that our prime goal was to make money anyway we could.The downhill slide was inevitable.

Bling is easier to sell than usefull products.

Alvin

Blimey Alvin, that was like over 15 years ago. The current crop of twentysomethings don't even remember that. What you have now is a clear "new" labour legacy that needs sorting out somehow. Tough times ahead I'm afraid.

Alvin · #30 (**permalink**) 18-07-2008, 11:11

Quote:

Originally Posted by SBP

Blimey Alvin, that was like over 15 years ago. The current crop of twentysomethings don't even remember that. What you have now is a clear "new" labour legacy that needs sorting out somehow. Tough times ahead I'm afraid.

Seems like yesterday to me.

Alvin